ENTJ's: Lucky in success, Unlucky in love


#1

I'm interested to hear the views of other ENTJ's (and everyone else for that matter) on this.

As an ENTJ, my personal strengths have led to continued success in academia and the professional world. Despite my substantial interest in financial and professional success, I have had one complaint that has obstructed my ability to enjoy my successes. This being the difficulty I have with forming deep and long lasting romantic relationships.

I, at 23 years of age, have had only two real relationships, neither of which continued past 2 months.

The first was on and off for 2 years (more off than on), and involved my HS sweetheart. I was too young to see she wasn't right for me, but luckily she knew I wasn't right for her.

The second occurred over the summer before my senior year of college and I basically lived at this girls place, but was never into her enough to put a label on it.

I realize that much of my inability in the realm of love, is indicative of my (past) status as a social neophyte. I have been working on this.

However, social awkwardness cannot fully explain (or even mostly explain) my hangups with women.

I believe that the reason I have so much trouble with the opposite sex (and social situations in general) is that I hold, potential romantic partners, (or other social acquaintances for that matter) up to the same standards I hold myself. Thus, it becomes a situation where I either, 1) fall head over heals for the person and want to spend the rest of my life with them instantaneously because they live up to my (admittedly) ridiculous standards, or 2) I only want to have sex with them because I am physically attracted to them but some other issue prevents me from opening up myself to emotional attachment. While this issue is often justified, i.e. she makes me want to jam a #2 pencil into my temple every time she opens her mouth, I feel that I too often nip potential relationships in the bud before I give the other person time to get to know me, or time for me to really get to know them.

In the first of the two instances presented above, my snap judgment and pursuit don't really stand as a social detriment, except for the fact that I've only encountered one girl in my experience on this planet that stirred my soul in such a way as to make me want to commit to her unconditionally, and that in that situation, my undying and immediate affection combined with her having a long term BF I didn't find out about until 3 weeks after I met her led to me scaring her off or pushing her away.

In the latter of the two instances, it often happens that I end the sexual contact the instant I realize that they don't fit into my ideal view of what a SO should be, or I just continue sexual contact in the knowledge that I will never pursue anything more. This second option comes to pass mostly when I immediately know that the girl is crazy and doesn't warrant emotional attachment. The first however, has been occurring more and more often as I have aged.

I have noticed a similar dynamic in the way I formulate friendships. Either they fit into what I think they should be and I become best friends with them, or they don't fit and are either regulated to acquaintance status or are discarded all together.

Basically my main issue is this, how can I best reconcile my desire for a relationship with my inability to accept anyone who doesn't fit into what purpose they should play in my life without compromising my rigid, and often life saving system of ideals?

I know its vain to look at others solely based on what they can do for you, and I hate that I do it, but so far I haven't had too much luck with, or incentive to change my ways.

Any thoughts or perspectives would be welcome! Thanks for listening.


#2

:astonished:

Which standard of your own which you'd like to see in a partner is the most important? (Just so I may understand your concern better)


#3

I think I understand what Discobiscuit is saying/ feeling, but there are some important differences between your approach and mine.

As I've gotten closer to 30, I've almost exclusively dated only girls with whom I could initially envision a long term relationship (and there have been very few). In my early twenties, it was often ok if I thought the girl was cute enough, but even then it wouldn't really last longer than a couple weeks before I moved on. And yes, I agree - it is almost always was because the girl doesn't meet my standards. Of what? Mostly self esteem and overall happiness. I like myself, and I would like to be with someone that I admire, and that admires themselves. Its unfortunately ridiculously difficult to meet girls that are both strikingly beautiful and have high self esteem. There's some that pretend to have high self esteem, but those are possibly worse. And there's those that have one or the other. It could be possible I'm wrong, and have been looking in all the wrong places.... but I suspect I'm right.

That being said, I do work very hard at meeting my own standards - I know I'm not perfect, but I keep getting better with time, and I'm always seeking improvement. I realize that the perfect woman also seeks the perfect man.

However, with friends, its different in some ways. Typically, most guys desire only one girlfriend, and eventually wife. However, its possible to have multiple friends and acquaintances. Which means that while it would certainly desirable to be friends with only the most perfect people, its not necessary - you can have different friends in different contexts, so that your entire network of friends adds up to perfection in aggregate rather than individually. i.e. You might have different friends to have long philosophical conversations with, and different friends to go out with, and yet a different group of friends to do business with.

That may be ideal for a harem as well, but these days that can get expensive! :banana-dreads:

As for your question: "Basically my main issue is this, how can I best reconcile my desire for a relationship with my inability to accept anyone who doesn't fit into what purpose they should play in my life without compromising my rigid, and often life saving system of ideals?" my answer is this:

  1. Make sure your 'P' is developed, so that you understand the people in your life (i.e. are you a good listener?) because it is dangerous to make an important judgment on someone without understanding them first.
  2. My choice has been to wait it out for the right girl; there are several core values I'm not going to bend. It means waiting longer, but I'm way too young to compromise.
  3. Are you living up to your own ideals? If you're looking for the perfect woman, she had better think you're the perfect man.
  4. While your desire for a relationship may be very strong and intense - make sure you realize that your life's meaning doesn't revolve around that alone.

#4

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#5

You know i have same problem i am 22 but it has to do with my religion. When i was in college i was loved by girls even the best of the best. But everytime they approached me, i always used to look at them and analze them try to see if they will be a hindrance to my goal or if they will be a good thing for my goal. If they can endure. If i thought this girl, is not worthy of me. I would not even approach them even ring them when they give me their number. Sometimes some of them have cried, some have got hurt to the point they become a shadow of their former selves when i don't take them as their boyfriend. when i think about i feel bad about myself. I think maybe it had to do that my feeler was not developed i became too logical in everything but now ha ha ha i am so perfect. I have to the point where i can feel what is in a person 's heart and i use mind to image verything for me and communicate it. I got to the point where i can tell a woman what is in her heart and tell her what her deepst hope and feelings are in life. What she wants without asking her. And i am getting more popular and the girls want me so bad, my feeling type abilty has developed. ITS INCREDIBLE BE VERSATILE MY FELLOW ENTJ, it doesn't mean if you are ENTJ you have to be what you are told you are be versatile learn you weaknesses, imagine if you can be like all the types be able to make them happy and even manipulate the other types at your will. IMAGINE THAT imagine it


#6

Don’t be afraid to go with your right brain in romantic matters. Left-brain lists of what you want can be so limiting, and inaccurate anyway. You’re not looking for a business partner anyway.


#7

I will say I have acquired more wealth, prestige and status, without a woman in my life, than with one. Why?

Well I think one reason is that as an ENTJ, one must really be in tune with themselves before getting into a relationship. Our personality, is not easy to be with, it takes a special person to be able to love us. This I have found out the hardway, I hope and pray that other ENTJ’s on the forum, can explore themselves truly before getting involved with other people, let me give you an example of this:

My Exe’s:

Typically dated men who were not ENTJ’s; therefore, they felt the need to stroke their ego’s and allow them to do certain things to make them feel like men.

Me:

(When I did not know I was an ENTJ), did not require ego stroked, I did that myself. I did not require her to make me feel like a man, I feel like one every morning I wake up.

This lead most of my exe’s to believe that they could not make me happy; and they felt unsure about themselves. They had never met a man; who turned down their ways affection/ego stroking.

Me:

(After learning that I Was an ENTJ). Realized that affection to me, came in the form of lauding me for my accomplishments, and giving good correction about my failures. As an ENTJ, we always seek to improve, so we do not need anyone to compliment us on stuff we already know WORKS.

In the end, I have grown comfortable with, my personality type, and I know that I am ready to be in a relationship; I just have to let the Lord lead me to the right woman. I figured I would give him a try, because my efforts have been pretty bad LOL.


#8

Hahaha - awesome post! Its like someone was telling my story. I’d like to add that I also think that affection for me includes being considerate and loyal (i.e. a team player), and obviously physical affection. But for 95% of it - I’m with you, man.

I especially liked this line: “They had never met a man; who turned down their ways affection/ego stroking.” I have almost used the same words! I wonder if it is an artifact of the generational dynamics of the time we live in… i.e. maybe things were different in the 1940s and 50s?


#9

Hey Complex Mango,

I think your on to something with that 40’s to 50’s thing. But also I think it is this. Many women attempt to love men like they love their fathers, brothers and Uncles. For the ENTJ, this is a disaster waiting to happen; because most men are not ENTJ’s. A good woman will actually take the time out to figure out what makes us tick, and then apply her love in the appropriate manner.


#10

Hey I feel u. I am a woman, 38 ENTJ too, and I could not find the person with whom being on the same wave length, and in any case, never too long.
The feedback I had was “u r too strong for ur own good”.
Regarding standards, I have spotted mine, sky high, quite young, so I made a point in not meeting them, for obviously nobody ever likely would.
But in the end, it never was right. Nor my place. And like I think, we r entitled to receiving what we r capable of offering. I can bring dedramatization sense of humour, sex, cooking, and fidelity. No drama but teaming up in fun basically.
Well, still on my own.
So yep, success everywhere but in the love life.